There are a lot of gurus out there!

Elena here are my thoughts on your question. The reason that some of the successful investors start selling the information they have learned for such a high price is that people will pay for it. I know that seems like a silly answer but it is true. The reason they make it seem simple is because simple sells. Have you ever noticed that they are all priced about the same? The market determines what price the market will bear. Every smart business owner wants to get full market price for their product. I know when I want to rent out a house that I want whatever the top of the market rent is for the house. If market rent is $1000 per month then surely I would be foolish to ask for $700 per month. Many times price determines quality. A person that is in the market to rent a house and realizes the prices of the houses she wants to rent range between $800-$1000 per month then she will not even consider answering an ad that promotes a rental house for $600 per month. She won't even answer the ad. She won't even want to look at the house because "something must be wrong with it." I know this is true because I have interviewed hundreds of people, literally. These gurus have also figured that out. They don't want to be the cheapest program out there because of two reasons.

1. He who has the cheapest product will attact bargain hunters looking for a cheap products. Low prices in their book determines value not content. Many times people looking for the cheapest price also want "something for nothing" which creates many problems after the sale.

2. Only the people that do not know how to sell have the lowest prices. They lower their price to attract buyers instead of creating value and asking for a higher price. If you are the low price product in your market you will always expect your competitors that don't know how to sell to lower their prices and soon you will find your profits are eroding. An example. Who do you think has to be a better salesman? A person selling Mercedes Benz or a person selling Chevrolets? The person selling Chevy's of coarse because he knows if he doesn't close the sale the person buying will just go somewhere else to another dealer willing to lower the price. The person buying the Chevy is looking at price and the person buying the Mercedes is looking for quality. (as a side note I drive a Chevy so I can say that).

I go to tons of seminars on whatever subject I am trying to learn. I don't make my decision on price. I make my decision on quality. I want info from the best. Also, to let you know I don't go to real estate seminars. I was part of the coaching program and the information I learned from that is still paying me every month. I do know some people personally that have flown around the country attending seminar after seminar after seminar. Every time I see them they tell me about a new technique they learned to make a fortune in real estate. Sadly, most people I know like that have never even bought one property. They don't want to get started because they need more information. They are happy being "in the process" instead of being "results driven." Those people have not clearly defined their dreams. I hope this answer ins't too long. It is just my opinion.

Elena, thanks for starting off your blog. Remember, this is "your space", so feel free to talk about whatever you want whenever you want. I think other members will enjoy getting a perspective into lots of different aspects of the IC members.

-DGadmin

from my personal exsperience i wander the same thing there about gurus out there , from our private messages you know what i mean there . im just glad i decided with this deans program , the last program i was soo confused on some of the stuff, here i can ask questions i get answers
mike

I do understand your frustration. Fear can sometimes stop you in your tracks and can cause a lot of pain. Eventually though, the pain of staying the same overcomes the pain of change and you will beat your fears. The one thing about schools that I disagree about though is that most colleges do charge more for their info than these gurus. Most of the best colleges and universities charge over $30,000 per year and higher and make you buy books for $200 each that will be obsolete by the end of your semester and then to make matters worse they will send a teacher that has zero experiance and zero results in the subject their teaching to teach the class. Oh, and they don't give you any gaurantee that you will ever make a dime from the education you receive. 5 years, $150,000 of debt, no guarantees, taught by someone that doesn't have real life experiance--sounds like a scam--and people are actually paying it! Now, that makes the few thousand these gurus are asking seem pretty affordable. $2500, 2-3 days, and taught by someone with results. Nobody can guarantee results. It still has to be applied. When I joined Dean's coaching almosf 3 years ago I was also scared. I didn't know a single thing about real estate. I had always lived in an apartment. I didn't have hardly any money. I didn't even know how to paint. But I was hurting so bad inside because nothing in life was going very good for me. I couldn't take it any longer. I decided that's it. I have had enough. I am not officially a millionaire yet, but I will be by the end of the year. So do I think the cost was worth it? Yeah, it was worth it. My net worth doubles that amount every month. I am not trying to say "look at me" but rather "if I can do it anybody can". It is possible to make millions within a couple years of learning from the gurus and can I say no college education will make that possible. Have FAITH, move forward, set goals, and take action are usually the the things I tell myself. You will notice that when I post on dg.com I rarely write any "how to" info. Mainly because it is already available. I would rather post a success story or a post about how it is possible if you just believe in yourself. I feel that helps people more than the "how to". It doesn't take money to make money. And there is only one thing stopping most people from succeeding and that is themselves.

The SHOW ME state...

I agree, it's one thing to tell me, why don't they SHOW me? Take me on a couple of deals, let me be there from the beginning (finding the lead, calling them, etc) all the way to the end to making the offer and why to signing the contract. I paid well over $10k with the understanding that I was going to actually watch this guru find the deals and he was going to do your first deal with you. Well, needless to say, that never happened and I never got my money back either. I also never applied his strategies when I bought my first duplex. My motivation was being forced to move because my mother had passed and my siblings wanted their inheritance. I was on the waiting list for housing and didn't make enough money from my job and playing music to afford $900 in rent for a three bedroom. So I started taking classes at the Urban League (1st time homeowner program) and found out my credit was excellent so I qualified for a great mortgage rate, the problem was I still couldn't afford a $900 payment, so my Realtor suggested a duplex to help me with the payment. I bought it the traditional way, but with no money down because I got an 80/20 loan. I always had it rented because I needed help with the payment. I owned it a year, the market changed, I sold it and made $48k. By now I was well into my training and had a friend who was also taking a mentorship helping me, we kept each other motivated. He had more hands on experience than I did as he has been rehabbing for over a decade, although I was gaining knowledge quickly, I didn't know how to apply it. The next house I found, he was on the initial call with me asking the right questions, giving the right answers and with his help I locked it up. Then by shear desperation I re-assigned it and made another $24k within 6 months. Bottom line is, I probably wouldn't have gotten it had it not been for his help. I had NO clue of what I was doing, I fumbled all through that deal. When the owner had any questions I had to call my friend, I didn't have answers because I didn't have that experience or knowledge yet, I was learning about stuff like short sales and foreclosures. I'd go with my friend to his rehabs to learn about bringing the value up, but I didn't learn the art of the mechanics of the deal. To me that's the most crucial part of it. Having the confidence of knowing that, makes all the difference in the world, in my opinion! How does Dean think up his offers? That's what I'd like to know and master! I'm the type of person, like most, that I don't like to attempt anything unless I know what the heck I'm doing or can at least fake it enough to look like I do... LOL!
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that going to college is any better financially than getting a guru, I agree with you 100% on that CBR. There are no guarantees with either one, except with college you get a degree, with REI courses you don't.

I guess I don't understand what you mean. I just started trying what the THINK A LITTLE DIFFERENT coarse and my coach told me to try and it worked. I never got hung up on the small details and just learned those by doing. Maybe I am misunderstanding what it is your asking? What is it that you don't understand during the phone conversation to a potential seller? I just try to make a friend and find out what they it is that they would want out of selling their home to me. What would solve their problem. If you come to an agreement and you lock up the deal on contract you make a decision from there on what you would like to do with the property. If you find motivated sellers it gets pretty easy. Then if you have potential buyers lined up or renters or people that would like to rent to own you link them up and create a stategy. It isn't as complicated as a lot of people make it seem. Most of the time you are talking to someone on the other end of the phone who has absolutely no idea what they are talking about. And if you make a mistake and say something wrong who cares? I got laughed at enough growing up that if somebody wants to laugh at me now who cares. That is their problem not mine. Although that has never happened to me in real estate, and it just isn't very likely. If there is something that you don't understand just post it in the general forum and you will have an answer within hours by someone. Dean thinks up his offers by talking to people and finding a need. When you want something bad enough you will find a way.

I appreciate all your input, your obviously a savvy investor in my opinion. I learned a lot from my last deal, believe me. What I was talking about was when I first contacted that owner, I asked all the questions to get him to open up that I had learned. But my friend had mentioned the tax advantages and disadvantages to him. I could tell that was the catalyst that started the process of building trust, because the owner was very grateful he pointed that out and that he didn't know that, of course neither did I... LOL! But I honestly believe that's why he called us back a month later, lowered his price and was ready to sell to us, he trusted us and knew that we honestly wanted to help him get rid of the problem house he had and we weren't just out to make a deal.
I've never had the priviledge of taking Dean's mentorship, I bought all of his other products though. Well, it sounds like it's the real deal to me, you're out there making deals. The ones I took covered so many subjects in such a broad spectrum leaving me with loads of questions and no one to answer them. But I will continue my REI education. I know that if I keep pursuing it I will get the experience I need to have all the answers when I need them.

Yes, CBR is very very good at what he does... he has been one of the most successful people to go through Dean's courses (CBR is on a first name [real name] basis with our company after all this time), and it is the same success we truly hope everyone would achieve.

CBR is a machine... he is the type of person that would probably succeed at just about anything he put his all into, because he has the right mindset, all or nothing. When you read his posts or ever meet him, this is very evident. Yes, clients can and do achieve a "middle ground" level of success, if that is the most commitment they can give, but I think everyone starts by wanting to go all the way.

But, I assure all of you, real estate investing is not something that requires a natural talent, like being a great writer, painter or someone that develops new mathematical theorems. Yes, for some it can come easier and more natural, but it is like being a mechanic in many ways.

With the manuals and right tools, anyone can rebuild an engine. For some it might take a year, and for others it might take a week, but it can be done by virtually anyone that really wants to do it. After your first couple rebuilds, all the sudden you don't need the manuals and you can start cranking them out in record times without running into many hangups.

In my opinion, Dean Graziosi is not a "guru" in the classical sense. When I think of gurus I think of people who are terrible at what they teach others to do, over promise and under deliver. This is because that is a very common experience I hear from their students (sometimes victims is a better term).

Ask these guru's when the last time they were investing in real estate was. Ask them to back it up with documentation. Most can't, that is why they are personal gurus or working the seminar circuit and not making their killing in real estate.

Dean makes a killing in real estate, and realized if he could take his lessons to the masses (not a handful of people or one on one) he could build his success from both real estate and business. Dean is always in the market, he has investments all over, and is a CURRENT and ACTIVE real estate investor as much he is a teacher and creator of tools and authors of books for both new and experienced investors.

All those of other infomercials for the most part, the "experts" or "gurus" on those shows, they haven't invested in real estate in ages, are selling ineffective or obsolete strategies and aren't committed to their students having success.

How do I know this? Not one of them has a open community like ours. The reason is they have a terrible success rate, terrible customer satisfaction (do some searches on those other gurus and there are thousands of very very serious complaints)... their communities would be filled with very jaded people probably participating only to steer others away before they made a mistake.

I've been working with Dean for a while, I know my REI, I've worked extensively with LOTS of investment vehicles, I know what the "competition" is like and because of that I understand why we have to try so darn hard to prove to people we are for real... it's because most of the "gurus" or real estate programs are terrible at best and scams at worst.

It is hard to get around the stigma that automatically is attached to you when you advertise through infomercials because of the vast majority of these other companies. We spend every ounce of our energy working on ways to get our clients successful, not how to get more money from them. Of course we are in business to make a profit, but if that was all we cared about, we would just be selling the same nonsense as the rest and sending you on your way and hope we never had to hear from you again. Instead, we want to build a lifelong relationship with every customer by operating this community and bringing everyone into a big family. None of this would be possible if it didn't work.

Sorry about the tangent there... I got a little sidetracked.

In terms of why it costs so much, CBR makes very good points. I would truly want all new investors to stay away from personal "gurus", seminars, and other programs until they have built a foundation though with us first. Otherwise, I'm afraid most of them will get taken for a ride. I've seen it many times. The funny thing is once you have a foundation with us, you'll realize that much of those things are a waste of serious money, serious time and you already know it a lot of it, it is just repackaged with new buzz words and maybe a slight twist if you're lucky.

When you think about it, we have lots of successful people on here, more being created everyday, who were in rough times and went full circle to being successful investors. These aren't actors on TV, these are real life people coming out of the woodwork and we're seeing them evolve before our very eyes, now that's exciting.

It all comes down to return on investment. Any investment, even a zillion billion dollars is worth it, if it provides a positive return.

But I want to make a case for why you don't need these expensive gurus and seminars, but also why it is important to understand that paying for quality and value is an important decision in any aspect of life, as CBR pointed out.

A quick example for context: Let's say I need to paint my house. The second story is 30 feet in the air, high enough to be fatal or paralyze me. I need a ladder though. At Walmat, they had one that big for $30, made in China no name. At Home Depot one that big was $180, but same brand all the contractors use on a daily basis. That $30 one looked like it was made cheap, and might not even last a year. Plus, I want to do the job right, and not have to worry about it failing on me. I don't know anyone with that $30 ladder either. I do know the $180 ladder has a proven track record of lasting long and being reliable. $180 is a lot of money for me, but which do I buy? The $180 ladder. Why? I am serious about not getting hurt, I am serious about wanting to do the job right, and I am serious about it lasting.

Let's look at the most common investment can people make with Dean's stuff:
-His BARM book and/or Think a Little Different course
-AFF
-FAL
-Coaching

Many have been successful just using the book. Many opt to use a couple very modest priced tools that help them save a bunch of time (time is money, and the time you save with them is makes it something worth way more than it costs). When you think about it, that couple hundred bucks or so is a down right small investment when your return is hopefully a lifetime of a very lucrative earnings.

Those that opt for the coaching are usually people who want fast tracked and a head start, someone to walk them through it all, like a college professor. They want them to avoid making very costly mistakes (more than the cost of the coaching in some cases), and people that aren't self starters are kept moving in the right direction. Let's say the coaching costs a few grand depending on how long you want to use it. Maybe you are in now for $3,300 investment.

The return on it though, again is a lifelong skill, used for both generating lucrative income, including just hopefully saving many times that amount the next time you a house to live in.

I just hope everyone realizes how much value there is in this stuff, and what it means towards the rest of their life if they go all the way.

Imagine if someone told you that you could go through medical school and become a doctor for a few hundred or even a few thousand dollars and be a doctor and make a killer salary, and do it all in just a few months... you would probably say their is no other program on the planet with as much value as that. See the parallels?

Sorry again, Elena, I know I kind of mixed a few different points into this, and got off on a tangent about our stuff more than the "gurus" out there. I just feel really strongly about what we do and very proud of all the students out there making moves and what we as a company have been able to help them achieve. Hopefully I didn't go too far off course that hijacked your comments on this, lol!

When you guys all get to hear about the success stories (all documented too) we just got from the recent contest, I don't think anyone will have any doubt in their mind that Dean Graziosi is the real deal and that our company is truly striving to be the best there is at what we do. The success of the clients really is the best way to measure it by, and I think we're setting the curve.

i read your points, there i think from speaking with elana before her and i went through a bad tasting program before ,so i can see where shes comming from , i am proud to be one of the ones
that had the opertunity to take part in the video
shooting on my triplex , yes i do believe in dean
and hes program , elana keep your head up your doing great!!!
mike
wasilla,alaska

Thanks for the input. Mike hit the nail on the head. I've paid a pile of money on my REI education, at least 4 times more than what I would've paid for Dean's coaching and it wasn't worth that much money. But I won't stop trying to master REI, I'm always continuing my education. Just like my daily ritual, I keep looking at the copy of my $48k check so I continually remind myself that I kaiboshed before and I will kaibosh again... LOL!

I actally had to read your first 2 paragraphs a couple of times. Here's the thing. What I have done is only about 10 percent more effort than what the average guy does. But the 10 percent means EVERYTHING! It's like running a mile race against 10 other people and your winning the race and 200 meters before the finish line you let up (or actually you decide to watch TV that night) and the victory slips away from you. There have been times when I was reading posts on dg.com and I nearly broke down because of the pain I could feel from people hurting, I wish they could understand that they are just so close to victory, just don't let up, keep running as hard as you can...God will honor your commitment. Focus on your strengths...not on your weaknesses. Don't let the negative thoughts overtake your mindset. You have a communtiy of people backing you, you are in business for yourself but, not by yourself. Get it done!

I always enjoy reading what you post. I too thought for a long time about where I an going and how I am going to get there. I bought the book, got think a little diff audios and now I am in the coaching program with Eric as my coach. I must admit though I think I am a senior member here because my hair is going al white. I guess I will always be scared when trying to put something together. I haven't done a deal yet, but I can see a bunch of light at the end, and it will happen and I will be successful. Lot of rambling on, but just real glad to be here...Jan

Always Walk In the Sun

Guru
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Guru" (Sanskrit: गुरु) comprises two words 'Gu' means darkness 'Ru' means light (prakash).
The word guru means a preceptor who shows us light (known) and destroys the darkness (unknown) through his knowledge. It is also used for teacher or guide

Dean, my favorite "guru".

Elena, my favorite "fake guru"-buster.

Lena, I'm glad you posted this because as you have become a believer in Dean's program, you reinforce it's credibility, since you did not start OUT with rose-colored glasses.

I, on the other hand, had no experience with any other real-estate program and have therefore been sheltered by coming across the BEST first. I don't think I would have ventured much farther than ONE if I'd have gotten a raw deal. So I'm VERY impressed with your determination, and I'm so glad you found "the real thing" this time.

VERY glad to have you all as REI family,

Rina

Wow, that's funny, kind of a contradiction isn't it?Well, I'm a firm believer of Dean's programs. I must be, I've bought all of them... LOL! But like I've said before, I love to stay on top of what's hot now and working today, so I'm STILL buying books and courses to continue learning. I have over 7 other 'gurus' emailing me on a daily basis and all of them do webinars to sell their new course, so I'm constantly learning stuff. Man, I wish I could get paid for this because I love doing it... LOL!

And Jan, my hair's salt and pepper too, but it's better late than never. You'll do it when you're ready, don't give up. When we're rich we'll sit at the salon together dying those grays and sipping champagne!
God bless,
Elena ;D

Someone said it this way earlier and it's a truth in all areas of business - in order to be successful one must:
FIND A NEED AN FILL IT
Sounds over-simplified, but it's true, is it not? So the one poster that talked about asking questions and finding out what the person "needed" (hot-buttons) then trying to meet those needs fits that category.

One other thought...I, too, have ordered other companies products, etc. on real estate. One I ordered right before I decided to get Dean's book. I got the other company's product - looked over it and sent it back the same day? How could I know it wasn't what it claimed? It was all fluff and none of it really gave you any real information. My thoughts have been confirmed by the phone calls I have received several times from this company over and over again trying to get me to get into their coaching products. I feel this way about it --- (yes, I know continuing education is important so don't take this the wrong way) --- if I can't figure out what to do with a company's basic product that is offered then I feel that it is a rip-off. Sounds blunt, I know, but I believe it to be true.
Have I made my first deal yet? No - still working on getting to the point of taking that first step but I DO believe that Dean's book all by itself gives me the information I need to do what is needed! We all have to take some reponsibility and work, read and re-read sometimes. Too many times people (and, no, I'm not referring to any post in this section) want to be hand-fed everthing and then, guess what? Most of the time they still aren't happy because they want to continue to have that done. Again, I'm not talking about anyone in this blog so please don't assume that.
Bottom line that I believe to be true - Dean's deal is the real deal but there is no way that Dean or anyone else can or will ever give you EVERY detail about EVERY possible situation - that takes us deciding to do so.
Why not me? Why should I not be one of the one's that gets it and makes it?
Why not you?
Keep up the great work everyone!
Mike

Thanks for commenting. It's funny you said that at the end. "Why not me?" Asking myself that question changed my life. I always thought "No way, not me" before that, I never thought I could own a home let alone invest in real estate. It's only when I changed my mindset that things started to happen for me. The doors opened and they opened immediately, then before I knew it I had one deal, then I found my second. So you can order as many courses as you want, take all the coaching you want, have all the mentors you want, but unless you're ready to take a leap of faith and have the proper mindset, you won't take action. You'll stay in your comfort zone until something forces you to do it. Desperation was my force but belief was my fuel. Thanks again for your comments!
God bless,
Elena

Hi Everyone, I'm new here even though I finished Dean's book over 2 weeks ago. I soaked it up like a thirsty sponge...

Unlike some of you, I've had the good fortune of getting over my fear AT LAST! I ordered 'Carlton's' course and it sat in a box at the foot of my bed for 6 (yes, six) YEARS! Not weeks, not months, years! I knew in my heart of hearts I wanted to 'do' real estate but I let fear control me until one day I'd had enough of seeing everyone else move forward. We're ALL capable of doing this! Even though that course was very outdated by the time I opened it (LOL!!)it was because of ME- not anyone else. Realizing this was a true eye-opener! I'm the ONLY person holding me back.

Guess what? I went online (defnitely not in the course I had @ the time) to search for EBay properties and bought 2 sfr and 4 duplexes (using a HELOC)that were tax liens. They all needed various amounts of rehabbing. Did I make mistakes? You betcha~ but I found out what their fair market value was before I bought them and realized that I was buying a bucketload of equity, and it was scary but thrilling when I 'pulled the trigger'. I hired contractors long-distance with **** credentials and references and fake photos of their "jobs". I was WAY too trusting! I even had to sue. Lesson learned. But since then, I've rented my newly rehabbed properties out and refinanced each one to do the next, a little @ a time-still working on it, and with nicely rehabbed homes, rent them out to responsible Section 8 single Moms. I used to live in a studio apartment with my 2 kids and at one point, paid rent with my credit cards.

We can each make a difference in our own lives AND in the lives of others by what we choose today. I'll be glad to help anyone with what little knowledge & experience I have. I encourage everyone to go out & wholesale to get started too! Dean gives all of us the greatest tools available- his phenomenal spirit, love of and experience with real estate and people, and his integrity. I believe DG has the magic that transforms us into who we're meant to be... HAPPY, HEALTHY REAL ESTATE ENTREPRENEURS!! YEA!
(Whew-I got a little long-winded...)

Alright, you did it. Even though you faced those obstacles you still got out there and took action and it paid off. Good for you! Don't worry about being long winded, I love to hear success stories, so keep 'em comin!
God bless,
Elena

Am new to this endevour but am so exited with all the info. I've learned so much from you all and can't wait to put all this info. into practice. I realized this business is for those who are risk takers and for those who can stand up again when they stumble. Some of you guy's story is so inpirational that I thought to myself what the hack I'm doing watching TV all day during the weekend. Now that our team had bowed out(NYG)I should gathered my tools and do some digging in the snow may be I could find some deals. Happy house hunting to you all and GOD BLESS!!!!

I'm glad you liked it. Welcome to the DG family, we're so glad to have you here. You've taken the first step in changing your life, don't quit and you will achieve your goals! You may hit a brick wall along the way, just re-route your path and continue forward, that's the key. Stay the distance. I wish you all the success, may 2009 be your BEST year!

God bless you,
Elena

Thank You Elena. I have to make it happened no one else. I have to push my own magic button. What all you guys posted here worth a million dollars, so educational and realy, at least inspired me.

GOD BLESS YOU AND YOUR FAMILY.

No thanks are necessary, it gives me great joy to help or inspire others. We're all on the same journey in life, to learn and grow. You can make ANYTHING happen if you believe it and feel it, so go for it! Thank you for the blessings, they are always appreciated.

God bless you richly,

Elena

Just interested to know if anyone out there has joined Dean's coaching program that I could talk with on this forum or by phone. I purchased Dean's two books, "Profit from RE Right Now" and "Be a RE Millionaire". Very detailed books and extremely interesting. Also purchased Dave Del Dotto course in the 1980's and also Carleton Sheets course. Have not signed up for Dean's couching as of yet and would like to talk with someone in my area of Penna. about their experiences thus far, both pro and con. Thank you so much.

I'm very new to this blog, I want to know if there is anyone in Massachussett that doing exactly what Dean teaches. I always wanted to do REI but so far things are not going the way I want them to go. My story is I own my home and a condo that I previously leaved in but now it is a rental, the bad things is I have to add 300 to the rent money to pay the mortgage so I feel that this is wrong but I have no choice now because I can even sell, it worth less than I owe on it. any suggestion anyone that really know thing are in MA. I don't want to sound to picky but some off the deal I heard or see on the TV show does not exist in my state. so what do I do to start investing. please Anyone tell me

Thanks butha

Work with an investor and lender for a short sale